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  • Libertarianism pretty much is morals.
  • "Rand is so much deeper of a thinker than Chomsky." Funniest shit I've read in a while. Right-wing "libertarians" are so ridiculous. "Economic freedom" my ass. <---- Hehe
  • "Rand is so much deeper of a thinker than Chomsky." Funniest shit I've read in a while. Right-wing "libertarians" are so ridiculous. "Economic freedom" my ass.
  • I have seen Europeans refer to anti-state syndicalist socialism as "libertarian". This doesn't particularly bother me in that such labels are amorphous to begin with.
  • If I'm not mistaken, the term Libertarian is considerably different in Europe than the US, which is possibly why Mr. Chomsky is the top "artist" here. If this is the case, perhaps someone could re-write the very American-ized wiki up there?
  • it's so bothersome to see Chomsky and Rand on the same tag page... \\ thedamnedrules: "Rand is so much deeper of a thinker than Chomsky" lol, that's an entertaining notion. Have you even read Chomsky?
  • In others news, though, where the hell is Rush in this? They're definitely the biggest band with explicitly libertarian lyrics I'm aware of.
  • @Gunnjon (continued): Emma Goldman was completely lacking in a respect for private property, and thus cannot present a legitimate case for individual rights, and thus cannot present a legitimate case for liberty. And you should probably learn to spell the words "speech" and "likable". @thedamnedrules (again): Eh, different people define what a State is in different ways. The original self-identified anarchists generally also considered themselves socialists. A slave society is a slave society, regardless of whether or not there's a State, so I'm willing to cede them the terminology of calling themselves anarchists and debate the issues at hand of individual rights and the total sovereignty of private property.
  • @Gunnjon (continued): Rand did not believe that "poor people" are parasites, only that there are those who are, and also that there are wealthy individuals who are equally, and sometimes moreso, parasitical. Anyone who has taken the time to actually read books such as Atlas Shrugged and The Fountainhead would know that Rand has both impoverished protagonists (Howard Roark for much of The Fountainhead, Henry Cameron in the Fountainhead, the sculptor in the Fountainhead, John Galt in Atlas Shrugged) and wealthy antagonists (all of the Taggart family with the exception of Dagny Taggart in Atlas Shrugged, Ellsworth Toohey in The Fountainhead, Gail Wynand in The Fountainhead, Peter Keating in The Fountainhead, the countless pseudo-intellectuals in both, and Mr. Thompson in Atlas Shrugged). Referring to Rand as a classist clearly indicates a complete ignorance of her actual views and likely just vague assumptions based on ad hominems from angry leftists.
  • Pretty much everyone in this shoutbox is misinformed. @thedamnedrules: In the modern American sense of the word that describes people like Murray Rothbard, Ron Paul, and Frederic Bastiat, yes, Noam Chomsky definitely would not be a libertarian. However, the word "libertarian" originally referred to a group of radical anti-heirarchial socialists who (ostensibly) oppose the existence of (what they define as) a State. Noam Chomsky fits this definition (though, as I've heard Jello say he doesn't consider himself an anarchist, he probably doesn't). Oh, and even though I would personally agree that Rand fits the modern American definition of "libertarian", it was a title (perhaps in part because of the older socialist baggage) that she herself disdained. @Gunnjon: Rand was a brilliant author and non-fiction essayist even if from a purely aesthetic context. Despite my profound respect for her in that area as well as a philosopher, I'd have to agree that much of her personal life was shitty.

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