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3rd Gen Ska-Still Ska??

 

  • 3rd Gen Ska-Still Ska??

    in response to Aughtstar's comment on 3rd gen ska in the "monkey do" thread -"why call is ska anymore?". I wonder if the new "ska" has lost its soul--lost its way...its evolved (using the term lightly) into a horrible bastard child that lacks the feeling, and groove of original ska. it lacks the urgency, playfulness and politics of 2nd gen.
    what has happened to it...i have an opinion on what happend --i will save it for later...

    please fell free to comment and critize. my knowledge is limited --if i am wrong please correct me...

    Thoughts??

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  • Sorry, I don't even check it that cause of few postings...I like the spirit of 3rd wave, or at least parts of it. It's just so different sound wise, there's a lot of other influences in it. Within Jamaican music, there's a distinction between Ska, Bluebeat, Rocksteady, Skinhead Reggae...even tho those things are pretty damn similar. Yet groups like Mighty Mighty Bosstones are included called just "Ska" when that is only one of their influences, they don't really sound like Eric Morris, do they? Even Two Tone is very different, but they were very aware of this and they covered a lot of the old Ska songs, but they knew it was a new style they were making.

    3rd wave has lasted way longer than that as far as continuous activity. So a new 3rd wave band could possibly only be influenced by older 3rd wave bands and simply think of that as "Ska". I'm not a purist at all, I like some of these bands, and what you call something is not that big a deal, but people should know where stuff is coming from originally and all the parts of it. That's why I made the group.

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  • Help me out here

    I don't know the difference between 1st, 2nd and 3rd gen Ska- can you give me some examples of each generation?

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  • 1st generation: Desmond Dekker, Justin Hinds, Skatalites.
    2nd generation: The Specials, The Selecter, Madness.
    3rd generation: Mighty Mighty Bosstones, Voodoo Glow Skulls, Save Ferris.

    This is my personal take on the different generations:
    Ska is basically dance music. It's supposed to have a groove that makes you wanna watusi all night. The 1st generation ska is all about that. The 2nd generation incorporated politics and observations about society into the music, and because the 2nd generation grew up alongside the UK punk scene, the beat became faster. It's still great dance music though. The 3rd generation ska, however, is neither political, nor very "danceable" (if that is a word), probably because it was influenced by the American "Blink182 scene". I probably shouldn't say too much about the 3rd generation though, since I'm not into it and not really informed; I only go by what little I've heard.

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  • SKA IS NOT DEAD!

    like any subculture these days you have bands like mighty mighty bosstones, voodoo glow skulls and even the new fishbone, that in my opinion are complete bullshit and have that pop-punk sound. But much like in punk there are bands that are true to the ska spirit making great music and who have an underground following. Latin american ska is probably some of the best ska right now, like:
    Skacha
    Obrint Pas
    Los Tres Puntos
    Skalariak
    piperrak
    skarabajos
    skaparapid
    kortatu
    I think maybe because mod and pop-punk are so irrelevant in our culture, ska is much rawer, almost like the original.

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    • mattlim said...
    • User
    • 21 Nov 2007, 04:12

    Re: SKA IS NOT DEAD!

    I miss pop punk influenced ska, particularly the Midwestern stuff like Slapstick and MU330. Irrelevant but fun as all hell.

    werd
    Matt L
    Life, the leading cause of death.
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    • murih said...
    • User
    • 15 Dec 2007, 14:57
    well...hmm...ahh.... try out 3rd ska gen. bands out of germany....like frau doktor, the clerks, die tornados, schwarz auf weiss etc...they donÄ't lost the "soul" they play it in the trad way ^^

    siempre ultra'
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  • Can anyone suggest any compilations available in the UK of first-gen then? I'm thinkin thats what i like the most... and compilations seem more fun to me.

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  • The Trojan Box Set's aren't too bad

    Also: One Original Step Beyond: The Story Of Ska

    These are good starts.

    Of course, it is always better to get full albums!

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  • A lot of the early stuff was only singles.

    You should be able to get the Trojan sets anywhere good, or from their website.

    The pop-ska torch has def been passed to Japan. Oreskaband, Muramasa, there's really a ton now, some other countries are doing it too, but it charts there.

    3rd wave is tricky...Toasters are really the quintessential 3rd wave band, early stuff is good, think I'm repeating myself. There's other bands like that, and the punk-ska or pop-ska or metal-ska, I just call it whatever. It's too confusing. I think that name comes from a comp with bands like MU330, Mustard Plug and Pie Snatchers (did I make that one up? pretty sure I saw them live.) A lot of those bands were ok, and fun live but the songs were mostly forgettable. The old stuff and Two-Tone have the best songs. Even Two-Tone got shitty towards the end...people run out of ideas.

    There is a lot from that early period, it's like there's always more, very consistent quality and sound. (not always literally "quality sound" cause even on cd it's from old vinyl, but I like that.)

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  • Ok, there was a series of comps. The first was just called "3rd Wave" I don't remember hearing it before that:

    SKA: THE THIRD WAVE CHECKERED BOX SET
    Beloved Records | released 1998

    Track Listing: MEPHISKAPHELES - Doomsday |MUSTARD PLUG - Too Stoopid | DANCE HALL CRASHERS - Othello |INSTEPS - Shotgun Jimmy |MEPHISKAPHELES - Saba | SCOFFLAWS - After the Lights Go Down Low | PIETASTERS - Factory Concerto | SKAVOOVIE & THE EPITONES - Hi-Ball |PIETASTERS - Night Before |SCOFFLAWS - William Shatner |TOASTERS - Dub 56 | MU330 - Stuff | RUDER THAN YOU - Swallow Blood |TOASTERS - Little Hidden Secrets | CHERRY POPPIN' DADDIES - Don Quixote | RHYTH-O-MATICS - Miami Skaline | UNDERCOVER SKA - My Girl Became a Dude (The Transexual...) | BRIAN O'SULLIVAN - I Gotta Do It (Someday) | PORKERS - Burnin' Love |TOASTERS - The Midnight Hour | SKANDALOUS ALL-STARS - Rock & Roll All Nite | INSATIABLE - The Munsters Cues | HEPTET - Pennsylvania 6-5000 | RUDER THAN YOU - Misskaculation [live] | ACTIVE CULTURE - Dick Tracy Cues | UNDERCOVER SKA - Music to Watch Girls By | STEADY EARNEST - Junko Partner | HEPTET - Inspector Gadget | RUDER THAN YOU - Paranoid [live] | BLUE MEANIES - Happy Together | OTIS REEM - La Unda | ALLSTONIANS - Mariachi Go Ska | ALLSTONIANS - Garlic Icecube | RYTH-O-MATICS - Riders in the Sky (Ghost Skankers) | RUDER THAN YOU - Swatara | SKAVOOVIE & THE EPITONES - Cat Juice | UNDERCOVER SKA - Skalp It | SKAROTUM - 4th Wave | SPRING HEELED JACK USA - Peg Leg Bates | ALLSTONIANS - Jerry Lewis | SCOFFLAWS - Watermelon Man | INSATIABLE - P.A.F. | JUMPSTARTS - Passage to Nigeria | LOIN GROIN - Jammin' (Master Blaster) | SKAVOOVIE & THE EPITONES - Parakeet | MUSTARD PLUG - Go | OTIS REEM - Jackie Chan | VOODOO GLOW SKULLS - Land of Misfit Toys | LINK 80 - Pretty Girls | LESS THAN JAKE - Son of Dick | VOODOO GLOW SKULLS - Shoot the Moon | ANIMAL CHIN - Time-Out | PLANET SMASHERS - My Decision | FLASHLIGHT - Blindsided | HONEY MOONERS - Out of Control | SUPAFLIES - Frustration | BRUCE LEE BAND - Proud | IMPOSSIBLES - So Much | ROYAL CROWN REVUE - The Walkin' Blues | SKAVOOVIE & THE EPITONES - She Sure Can Cook | MY MAN FRIDAY - Monkey Business | UNSTEADY - One for the Road | UNDERCOVER SKA - Dr. Kildare | ROYAL CROWN REVUE - The Rise and Fall of the Great Mondello | NEW MORTY SHOW - Caldonia (What Makes Your Big Head So...) | SCOFFLAWS - Groovin' Up [live] | DAVE'S BIG DELUXE - What I Used to Be | ALLSTONIANS - Walking in the Sand | SCOFFLAWS - Parish | SEVEN FOOT POLITIC - Old Gold | HIPSTER DADDY O AND THE HANDGRENADES - Swamp Thang


    Uh...so yeah. Cherry Poppin Daddies? I recall this was when things were already going downhill. Dub 56 was the last good Toasters album, 2nd Scofflaws was wack...I really liked Mephisksapheles, they went in a jazz direction after their first one, actually less commercial unlike most at the time. There is a TON of shitty 3rd wave or whatever you call it comps, def find the good bands and get the albums in that case.

    Old Toasters is good, BimSkaLaBim, Skankin' Pickle live records (RIP Lynette), Bruce Lee Band was also good but more punk, 1st Scofflaws is awesome...class by itself.

    Hepcat, Ocean 11 and Determinations are all great neo-trad bands...I know I'm repeating myself now....

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  • There's a fairly detailed discussion about what makes Ska here:

    http://www.last.fm/group/Ska+is+NOT+punk/forum/21502/_/124247#f1422191

    It's all in the rhythm section for me. One-drop, a walking bass, lively tempo & a bit of daftness make it Ska for me. There's loads of other stuff like Rocksteady, Skinhead, Roots, Dancehall, Two-Tone etc. that's good, but it ain't Ska.

    Happy New Year Ska fans!

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  • Well, I read that other thread, and I will have to disagree, at least when it comes to the 2nd generation. The Specials recorded a bunch of songs that would count as ska even by your definition. It wasn't just a 4/4 rock beat without the one drop, but real lively backbeat stuff. Then again, they didn't do that all the time, neither did the other 2nd wave bands. They weren't "pure" in that sense, and I guess the versatility of the music reflects the mixed environment it evolved in: blacks and whites, working class and middle class, immigrants and natives, "mods, rockers, hippies and skinheads", to quote one song.

    I can sympathize with your "purist" take on the matter, however. I'm the same when it comes to reggae. I want reggae to meet certain musical standards in order to call it reggae. To me, stuff like Ini Kamoze's "Here Comes The Hot Stepper" isn't reggae at all. To others, it is.

    When it comes down to it, it's not really a question of what you call it. The real question is: is it any good?

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  • Well, it's hard to clasify Ska into 1st 2nd and 3rd generation. We have bands like "Hepcat" and "Los Hooligans" which are new but are very "classical" in their sound, and then you have many songs by Mandess or The Specials which are kind of "brit-pop"...
    Some bands now a days call themselves Ska and differ enough from the original sound to the point where it's hard to call them Ska but then again many bands now a days are great and keep the traditional sound alive.

    Much recommend:
    "Los Hooligans"
    "Eastern Standard Time"
    "Orobians"
    "Super Agente 86"
    "Rotterdam Ska-Jazz Foundation"....

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  • antiloop68 said:
    Well, I read that other thread, and I will have to disagree, at least when it comes to the 2nd generation. The Specials recorded a bunch of songs that would count as ska even by your definition. It wasn't just a 4/4 rock beat without the one drop, but real lively backbeat stuff. Then again, they didn't do that all the time, neither did the other 2nd wave bands. They weren't "pure" in that sense, and I guess the versatility of the music reflects the mixed environment it evolved in: blacks and whites, working class and middle class, immigrants and natives, "mods, rockers, hippies and skinheads", to quote one song.

    I can sympathize with your "purist" take on the matter, however. I'm the same when it comes to reggae. I want reggae to meet certain musical standards in order to call it reggae. To me, stuff like Ini Kamoze's "Here Comes The Hot Stepper" isn't reggae at all. To others, it is.

    When it comes down to it, it's not really a question of what you call it. The real question is: is it any good?

    Can't really disagree with any of that. Bit harsh on the Specials for sure..

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  • 3rd Gen Ska-Still Ska?? some of it.

    in response to Aughtstar's comment on 3rd gen ska in the "monkey do" thread -"why call is ska anymore?". I wonder if the new "ska" has lost its soul--lost its way...its evolved (using the term lightly) into a horrible bastard child that lacks the feeling, and groove of original ska. it lacks the urgency, playfulness and politics of 2nd gen. what has happened to it...i have an opinion on what happend --i will save it for later... please fell free to comment and critize. my knowledge is limited --if i am wrong please correct me... Thoughts??

    There are a lot of 3rd gen ska bands that play traditional style. Hepcat and the Slackers to name a few. I think lumping all 3rd gen with pop punk ska isn't a good idea a lot of 3rd gen band hate the pop punk stuff.

    Also if you get a chance listen to hub city stomper's "ska train to dorkville" I think you'd like it.

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  • ............Ska is dead. Stone-dead. Really.

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  • thats a part of ska movement bro..
    now just how they are responsible for formulating them ska music.

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  • stepsbeyond said:
    ............Ska is dead. Stone-dead. Really.
    yes, if ska just become a trend

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  • If the band is playing the music using the basic Ska (original or 2 tone) style then it is Ska!

    Many bands are described as third wave Ska when they are playing something which is musically Punk or even Rock! There is nothing wrong with Punk, Punk-Ska or Ska-Punk, I enjoy all of these kinds of music but just because a punk band has a brass section doesn't mean that it is a third wave Ska band, musically it is still a punk band.

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