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429 members| 270 shouts

Leaders: LegoLibertarian
Join Policy: Open
Created on: 31 Jan 2005
A group for advocates of the individualist ideology known as Libertarianism. Vigilance towards liberty, in perpetuity!

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  • BlindSlaves

    23 Oct 2014 Reply
  • Tesla007

    Read Rothbard!

    6 Jun 2014 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    Just take it in stride. It's more important to convey principles and pro-liberty arguments versus trying to feel comfortable with a label, especially covering the anti-IP view here where it's most relevant. If you advocate libertarian philosophy, you might call yourself an ancap or a voluntaryist, but you're already there. If you're waking up to liberty it's fine, but get ready to have your premises challenged! :)

    26 Feb 2014 Reply
  • Siberiandreamer

    The word doesn't just appeal to your principles. Just because it works with a lot of true capitalist types, doesn't mean they aren't 'real' libertarians. Also, I was under the assumption most right libertarians were also against IP. There's a lot of misunderstanding from both sides, really.

    13 Jan 2014 Reply
  • Epigrammed

    Myself, I'm kind of torn on whether we should try to take back the libertarian label from these ridiculous pro-capitalists or just let it go. It's already pretty damn far gone.

    21 Nov 2013 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    A good number of libertarians are likely not offended by the word capitalism as it holds a different meaning for them, even if they prefer not to use it. I recognize that politicians butcher and twist language and the left has a negative reaction to 'capitalism'. I can more easily make my point with specific Austrian Economic arguments, OR I can go directly to voluntaryism to encompass all freedom of choice. Still, I find value in calling myself a libertarian even if I'm the post-anarchist variety.

    8 May 2013 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    You're not the first person to make a public statement about leaving the group because of a perception that the group was catering to 'capitalists' or 'conservatives'. A lot of people who come to libertarianism may come from a conservative background and there's going to be a lot of debate, but it's healthy debate and usually very civil here. Many of them are actually minarchists still clinging to the things they think the state is good for, but as they say the difference between a libertarian and an anarchist is about six months. :)

    8 May 2013 Reply
  • wargrave

    I'm not sure. I don't even remember writing that, but I guess I read people's shouts here and decided there were too many capitalists. That's good that you're against intellectual property! Then you're on the good side ;) Sorry about the rage!

    7 May 2013 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    On what basis did you come to that conclusion, wargrave? You said you 'get the feeling', but it doesn't really explain why. I, for example, don't believe in intellectual property, and that's saying a great deal as someone with a background in creating graphic art and design. Surely you're not disagreeing with me here, and I'm the current steward of this group. Who or what are you lashing out at??

    7 May 2013 Reply
  • wargrave

    Leaving this group because I get the feeling this is more about right wing-"libertarianism" than true libertarianism. Take your intellectual property and land ownership fascism and shove it up your asses

    26 Apr 2013 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    Welcome to the group, Ouroborosian. I think a good, honest libertarian would not only admit about themselves that they can make market mistakes or total blunders, but in fact recognize it as a fact of life. Not sure what 'market fundamentalism' means in that light, as failure should be the natural consequence of bad choices if you believe freedom of choice is the basis of an actual marketplace. Recognizing that there is no perfect system to eliminate mistakes, hazards, and tragedies from life is sobering but vital. I laugh inside when someone tries to discredit me wholesale for not providing them the blueprints for a perfect centrally imposed system for the rest of eternity as based on their prodding for answers to life's problems.

    23 Apr 2013 Reply
  • Ouroborosian

    So I think I've decided pretty definitely that I'm an economically pragmatic/centrist and capitalistic civil libertarian, as opposed to total market fundamentalism that admits no market failures.

    21 Apr 2013 Reply
  • khal_naqis

    29 Dec 2012 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    It's connected. :) Be sure to check to see all artists, and not just the few which rotate in this main page.

    21 Nov 2012 Reply
  • Martwy_Kogut should be connected artist.

    24 Oct 2012 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    Adding Tim Hawkins to connected artists. Can't get enough of his 'The Government Can' song.

    29 Sep 2012 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    This group is open to all liberty advocates, from the libertarian adept to the individual who is discovering the value of consistent ethics and a philosophy in search of truth. I'm disappointed that you perceive this as some sort of Tea Party group and that you've elected to leave the group on that premise. My last word on this subject is that libertarianism is open to self critique: Validating the principle of non-aggression is recursive and circular on account of the consistency of its principles. Put simply the ideology supports the freedom to dissent, and demonstrating free dissent validates the ideas behind the ideology.

    4 Jun 2012 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    There can be no effective discussion about the practice of applying the non-aggression principle without the inclusion of economic value theory. To the extent that you marginalize economics as separate from social interaction is where I believe you've gone astray. Value and preference applies to all actions, not just financial transactions.

    4 Jun 2012 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    I'm also among the voluntarist/agorists. As for the Tea Party comments, I just don't see it. The Tea party is a movement with people of varying beliefs, discontent with the system but mainly based on political action, and/or a movement appropriated by politicians who feed off of the discontent they have created. The Tea Party is not an ideology of internally consistent principles, so it is ineffective to try to generalize what all of those people believe and presume to call it their definition/take on libertarianism.

    4 Jun 2012 Reply
  • LegoLibertarian

    How is it implied that libertarians with a thorough understanding of economics are somehow unconcerned with social issues? Economics is more than finances. If anything, libertarians try to dispel the mythology that economics is inherently complex and synonymous with state central planning. Value theory strikes at the very core of volitional action and the ways in which our freedom is destroyed through political intervention. In any case, nobody is perfect, and some people need more time reading and discussing these ideas in order to figure out what it is they believe.. it makes no sense for me to ostracize people who are putting in an effort but have a few places where they dissent from the non aggression principle.

    5 Apr 2012 Reply
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